[Peace-discussion] Re: [gpus-del] Cali Delgate Drew Johnson openly challenges
extremely violent talking Duke
Drew Johnson
JamBoi@Greens.org
Sat, 21 Jun 2008 20:32:27 -0700 (PDT)
---------------------------- Original Message ----------------------------
Subject: Re: [gpus-del] Cali Delgate Drew Johnson openly challenges
extremely violent talking Duke
From: "Drew Johnson" <JamBoi@Greens.org>
Date: Sat, June 21, 2008 19:22
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
If people are not familiar with a broader understanding of violence that
includes 'verbal violence' and accompanying concepts of nonviolence
below's a pretty good definition from The Violence Initiative. As Greens
we want to strive to learn new tools and ways to handle conflict other
than violence, but as Aimee Smith likes to point out we *do* reserve the
right of self defense. Also below are some of the words of Gandhi on when
violence is necessary.
Green is Real!
Drew
_____
>From the GPCA platform (just one example of a number where this sentiment
is found in our official Green statements of policy):
"We recognize the need to protect society from violent [offenders]..."
_____
http://www.siue.edu/ALESTLE/library/spring99/apr.13.99/vision.html
VISION OF WORLD PEACE:
...
" There is no violence that is justified," Gandhi said. " But there is
some that is necessary.
'Gandhi also pointed out that there are different kinds of
violence...Passive violence is any kind of oppression, verbal abuse,
mental abuse, or prejudice.
"Passive violence leads to anger," he said " And anger leads to physical
violence."'
Someone in the audience asked how followers of nonviolence could protect
themselves from people who were violent.
" You would be right to use some violence to protect yourself or someone
you love," Gandhi said. " The trick is to know how much violence to use."
____
http://www.tviccv.org/index.php?pageid=66
THE VIOLENCE INITIATIVE
[...]
Violence is an uncomfortable subject. It has many faces and as many
causes. THE VIOLENCE INITIATIVE has chosen to recognise the range of
violence and to challenge all uses of it.
The following categories give examples of different types of violence as
described by participants in our programmes.
Physical violence: kicking, slapping, pushing, smashing and throwing things.
Verbal violence: shouting, screaming, not allowing others to speak and
name calling.
Psychological violence: threatening, controlling, undermining, making
someone feel worthless, ridicule and intimidation.
Emotional violence: rejection, abandonment, isolation, ignoring and
putting people down.
Societal violence: gangs, racism, bureaucracy, prejudice and discrimination.
Political violence: War, poverty, genocide and pollution.
We also include self inflicted violence: alcohol abuse, drug addiction and
self harm.
____
On Sat, June 21, 2008 18:53, Drew Johnson wrote:
> Oh and its entirely hilarious to see Henry say 'have you no shame?' This
> seems to come from someone who's likely to have heard this said to him so
> many times in the past (but it didn't take) and now he projects it
> outwards against those who call HIM to account. Amazing.
>
>
> Green is Sane!
>
> Drew
>
>
> On Sat, June 21, 2008 18:43, Drew Johnson wrote:
>> Henry as I wrote before you've ripped that quote completely out of
>> context
>> and twisted it to make it seem like something it doesn't mean. I've
>> never
>> nor would I ever advocate physical violence against you or anyone else
>> just because you slander and libel people.
>>
>> No, what Aimee Smithg and I were discussing was the use of 'violent'
>> coercive language -- ie. the kind that you engage in constantly and even
>> here in this e-mail I'm responding to. This dialog went way back across
>> several different e-mail lists over months time and you've only pulled a
>> small portion of it out of context and misrepresented its meaning (as is
>> par for the course for your tactics Henry).
>>
>> I was repeating to Aimee something she's pointed out numerous times --
>> that Greens reserve the right to use violence in self defense. Though
>> we
>> believe in nonviolence generally, we are not committed to unlimited
>> nonviolence and some of us will draw the line at different places than
>> others would. When we are attacked, physically or verbally we reserve
>> the
>> right of self-defense. Aimee has brought this fact up many times re:
>> Israel and its apartheid policy towards Palestine and Palestinians. I
>> was
>> merely pointing out that when our party and those in our party are
>> attacked (as you are doing constant these days) we also reserve the
>> right
>> to use strong (sometimes called 'violent') language to defend our party
>> and those in our party -- eg. Cynthia McKinney when people like you
>> smear
>> her.
>>
>> The attempt to paint me as somehow a 'male chauvinist' is completely
>> without merit. What an irony that you, a well-off white male is running
>> around throwing inflammatory terms like 'racist', 'male chauvinist',
>> 'censorship' and loads of other bullshit, just because others seek to
>> call
>> you to account for your disruptive and derogatory behavior. Sorry Henry
>> you're time on GPAX looks like it will soon, mercifully come to an end
>> by
>> the will of the very body that entrusted you to this position in the
>> first
>> place.
>>
>> In no way am I anti-Camejo or Anti-Gonzales. Where do you come up with
>> this shit Henry???
>>
>> On Sat, June 21, 2008 16:36, henry duke wrote:
>>> We had the open behavior of our paid staff to defame, undermine, and
>>> effectively expel my candidate who happened to be a historic long term
>>> African American Justice activist that would have lighted and inspired
>>> many
>>> youth of color and white 4 justice.
>>>
>>> Following that cointelpro-like episode we now have mr Johnson
>>> unrepentantly
>>> and without any open moderation or address by the California delegation
>>> after my twice written requests.
>>>
>>> Violence is violence. White male chauvinism and it censoring of the
>>> other
>>> via violence, violation, or other is undermining the Green Party.
>>>
>>> Has no one any decency?
>>>
>>> Is there no shame?
>>>
>>> Is there no recourse or accountability?
>>>
>>> Please?
>>>
>>> We CAN do better.
>>>
>>> Seriously,
>>> Henry Duke
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----------------------------
>>> Drew Johnson, whose words I asked the California Delegation of the
>>> green
>>> party repeatedly to review or clarify called for on a Green Party List:
>>>
>>> "We Greens *do* reserve the right to act violently in self defense and
>>> that
>>> is how I see this situation[against Henry Duke]."
>>>
>>> [Situation refers to anger that I oppose nominating Cynthia McKinney to
>>> run
>>> as our nominee because it is wrong for the Green Party not because I
>>> oppose
>>> McKinney as a de facto so-called movement leader.]
>>>
>>> I hope people see that the White Males who advocate censorship and open
>>> violence to suppress debate; people like Brent McMillan and Scott
>>> McLarty
>>> --both allegedly paid to impartially promote our party process while in
>>> fact
>>> raising up violence and police action, sexual and drug innuendo, as a
>>> means
>>> to kick out of our presidential campaign Black Womyn leaders who never
>>> voted
>>> for 3 strikes or to authorize the invasion of Afghanistan, never mind
>>> their
>>> media strategy which too often has echoed the state department or
>>> democrats
>>> against Bush, or implied that forced vaccination of girl-children of
>>> color
>>> should be given consideration rather than opposed in principle. [That
>>> press
>>> advisory was sent out on international womyn's day no less!!!!!]
>>>
>>> Nearly everything recently about Drew Johnson, and these past years
>>> about
>>> the anti-Camejo, anti-Gonzalez tendency/clique in the GPUS and GPCA has
>>> been
>>> about censoring those voices leading for diversifying gender, race, and
>>> class in the green party.
>>>
>>> Locally in my orange county green party it was like pulling teeth to
>>> get
>>> anything done in Spanish or to address how to involve immigrants --
>>> imagine
>>> the irony of the great 2006 May Day Boycott and Strike to see the
>>> Spanish
>>> OC
>>> Green Banner I practically forced on the OC Greens to be at the top of
>>> a
>>> mountain of humanity!!!
>>>
>>> Pride. Growth. Leadership development based on the 4 pillars and the
>>> ten
>>> key
>>> values.
>>> -- not based on how cruel, censorious, or how loud or rude one can be
>>> --
>>> to
>>> shut up the truth tellers.
>>>
>>> We can be silenced by the media and by these anti-democratic, White
>>> Patriarchs, but we are in fact resolved to continue to organize and
>>> ultimately win justice.
>>>
>>> Good luck and hope to see people at a Democratic Party Shadow
>>> convention
>>> and
>>> at future national solidarity, peace and justice events as well!
>>>
>>> And, yes, we are winning!
>>>
>>> Love,
>>>
>>> Henry Duke
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hank
>>>
>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may
>>> contain
>>> confidential and/ or legally privileged information. It is solely for
>>> the
>>> use of the intended recipient (s) . Unauthorized interception, review,
>>> use
>>> or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including
>>> Electronic Communication Privacy Act. If you are not the intended
>>> recipient,
>>> please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: peace-discussion-admin@lists.gp-us.org
>>> [mailto:peace-discussion-admin@lists.gp-us.org] On Behalf Of Aimee
>>> Smith
>>> Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 8:27 PM
>>> To: Drew Johnson
>>> Cc: peace-discussion@lists.gp-us.org
>>> Subject: Re: [Peace-discussion] Re: [GPUS-PAX] Re: [G-C-F] VIDEO:
>>> Global
>>> Green 2008 - Ross Mirkarimi - Withdrawals Support 4 McKinney To Obama
>>>
>>> Drew,
>>> You forwarded a private email relating to discussions on
>>> the GPAX list and natl affairs list to this third list? I don't
>>> understand why and am not willing to have this discussion
>>> here.
>>>
>>> Aimee
>>>
>>> On May 16, 2008, at 4:45 AM, Drew Johnson wrote:
>>>
>>>> Absolutely its a strong accusation v Henry, and sure one could term it
>>>> violent. As you like to point out Aimee, we Greens *do* reserve
>>>> the right
>>>> to act violently in self-defense and that is how I see this situation.
>>>>
>>>> Henry is facing a censure resolution in the GPCA delegation. You
>>>> like to
>>>> talk about accountability Aimee, and now you're going to get to see an
>>>> attempt to hold Henry to accountability.
>>>>
>>>> You are misinterpreting my point of view to say I am putting Henry
>>>> in the
>>>> 'evil box'. No, not at all. That does not accurately represent my
>>>> point
>>>> of view towards him in any way. Personally I have enjoyed talking
>>>> with
>>>> Henry and I share many of his interests, issues and concerns. I am
>>>> simply
>>>> objecting to his over-the-top posting behavior that is destructive
>>>> of the
>>>> GPCA and the GP-US. IMO it is perfectly acceptable for an
>>>> organization,
>>>> including a Green organization to have behavioral standards that it
>>>> enforces.
>>>>
>>>> As for the staff, I do agree with you that there seems to be a lack of
>>>> guidance and direction from the NC and SC towards staff and there is a
>>>> lack of accountability structure. When I say that I am not making
>>>> *any*
>>>> statement one way or the other about any specific situation, I'm
>>>> merely
>>>> observing a lack of structure. I also observe that along with that
>>>> lack
>>>> of structure there is also no contracts for the staff (if I'm
>>>> understanding that correctly) and I think that is reprehensible.
>>>> So I do
>>>> think we NCers need to get on the ball and create some sound
>>>> structure for
>>>> the staff.
>>>>
>>>> The Brown/McMillan affair is a whole thing unto itself that I will
>>>> refrain
>>>> from making assessments on at this time.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Green is Reality-based!
>>>>
>>>> Drew Johnson
>>>> GPCA delegate
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, May 15, 2008 22:46, Aimee Smith wrote:
>>>>> Saboteur?
>>>>>
>>>>> That sounds like a strong accusation. Maybe some
>>>>> would even call it violent.
>>>>>
>>>>> Are you sure this might not be as complicated as the
>>>>> Brown affair?
>>>>>
>>>>> It seems to me you have put Duke in the evil box, and
>>>>> thus no holds barred on him. Yet you expect people who
>>>>> mistrust people like Brent to hold to a higher standard of
>>>>> discourse.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I would like to add that much of my distrust for Brent is
>>>>> really structural and not personal. I think there is no meaningful
>>>>> accountability for staff in orgs structured as ours is. That isn't
>>>>> his fault, other than what he does to further the pattern, but he
>>>>> should be held accountable for speaking in such a way on
>>>>> behalf of our party and apologies should have been made
>>>>> asap.
>>>>>
>>>>> In any case, do you see the double standard here?
>>>>>
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Aimee
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On May 12, 2008, at 6:32 PM, Drew Johnson wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> For the Green Party their's no benefit to supporting people who are
>>>>>> not
>>>>>> our candidates, whether they be Obama OR Nader. They are NOT GP-US
>>>>>> candidates!!! Go work on Nader's campaign constructively Henry,
>>>>>> and leave
>>>>>> the Greens to do our tough work pulling ourselves together. We
>>>>>> have a
>>>>>> hard enough time without saboteurs like yourself.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Green is GREEN!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Drew Johnson
>>>>>> GPCA delegate
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, May 11, 2008 08:52, Henry D. wrote:
>>>>>>> What are the benefits to the Green Party to supporting long term
>>>>>>> democrats
>>>>>>> McKinney or Obama as Ross has done?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What are the benefits to the green party to supporting non-long
>>>>>>> term
>>>>>>> democrats like Nader and former Green Party leader Matt Gonzalez?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mike Feinstein <mfeinstein@feinstein.org> wrote: VIDEO:
>>>>>>> Global
>>>>>>> Greens 2008 - Ross Mirkarimi (USA) (English)
>>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OyT1q2ebHlo
>>>>>>> 12:25
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ross Mirkarimi, San Francisco Board of Supervisors, speaks about
>>>>>>> actions
>>>>>>> he's taken on the municipal level to deal with climate change.
>>>>>>> Global Greens Second Congress 2008. May 1-4, 2008.
>>>>>>> Fundacao Memorial da America Latina. São Paulo, Brazil.
>>>>>>> www.sfgov.org/mirkarimi www.rossmirkarimi.com
>>>>>>> www.cagreens.org www.gp.org www.globalgreens.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For videos of each individual speaker at the entire Congress, see
>>>>>>> www.globalgreens.org/brazil2008/videos
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For streaming video of the Congress as a whole, see
>>>>>>> www.proempresa.inf.br/sites/600/657/00000311.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> cal-forum mailing list
>>>>>>> cal-forum@cagreens.org
>>>>>>> http://lists.cagreens.org/mailman/listinfo/cal-forum
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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